对话土耳国宝级作家李凡纳利

作者：黄潇
日期：2010年6月17日 星期四

作为土耳其文化政治先锋，李凡纳利是作家，作曲家也是政治家。他进过军事监狱，流亡过国外，做过国会议员，当过联合国科教文组织的亲善大使。他曾在出狱的15年后，在监狱附近的广场开了一场近50万人参加的音乐会。他的一生大起大落，具有传奇性。更为重要的是他豁达的人生态度，尖锐而又犀利的文笔影响了很多土耳其年轻人。《伊斯坦布尔的幸福》是李凡纳利众多小说中反映土耳其现实最出名的一部。这部小说描写了三个核心人物，一个被族长强暴后，又被家人强迫自决的少女玛丽，年轻而又困惑的突击队退役队员玛尔和事业有成但精神空虚的中年教授伊凡。

Artinfo: 写作，作曲，拍电影，你更喜欢哪一种工作？
李凡纳利：音乐是最好的表达情感的方式。如果要刻画一些人物，讲述故事，写作是最好的方式。拍电影需要很长的时间，而且需要团队的合作。如果有一个人做不好，就会影响整部作品的质量。写作的话我一个人就能完成。

Artinfo: 玛丽是否一定程度上代表了土耳其年轻女性？
李凡纳利：事实上在我开始创作时，这位教授才是我的核心人物。后来，我想加一个来自土耳其南部的一位少女的故事。一旦这个女孩进入了我的这部小说，关于她的故事情节就变得越来越多。这个并不是我最初的计划，可以说“她”创造了她自己。她代表了很大一部分土耳其女性的现状。总的来说，我觉得女人比男人更坚强。她们要工作，还要生孩子，照顾家庭，承担很多的责任。很多人觉得女人比男人更感性化，但我觉得女人不但感性化而且理性化。

Artinfo: 流亡国外的八年中你都经历了什么？
李凡纳利：我在欧洲其它的国家结识了很多音乐家，艺术家。我很庆幸自己“国际化”的身份，我可以学习和理解其它国家的文化。那段时间的生活是很困苦的，因为我没有钱。但谢天谢地我的音乐也很受欢迎，所以我不需要像其它人那样去餐厅涮盘子。

Artinfo: 从政治逃犯到国会议员，你有什么感受？
李凡纳利：我的护照说明了我人生的经历。我的第一个护照是为了逃到国外而做的假护照。我的第二个护照是联合国的难民护照。第三个护照是普通的土耳其公民护照。第四个护照是联合国科教文组织亲善大使的护照。第五个护照是我是为国会议员后所持的高级别的政府官员护照。想象一下吧，我拥有不同的护照，不同的身份，但我还是我，同一个人。当我用我的第一个护照时，我是政治逃犯，但我换用红色的第五个护照的时候，我是政府官员，太荒谬了。这个社会太官僚化了！

Omer Zülfü Livaneli — author, composer, folk singer, and filmmaker — is a towering figure in the cultural and political life of his native Turkey, where he once served as a member of parliament. Briefly imprisoned and then exiled for his political activism in the 1970s, he remains a champion of progressive causes, including women’s rights
and friendship between the people of Turkey and Greece. He has written hundreds of popular songs and over 30 films soundtracks, including the score for “Yol” (“The Way”), which won the Palme d’Or at  Cannes in 1982.
His first novel, “The Eunuch of Constantinople” (1996), drew instant acclaim and was widely translated. His latest work of fiction, “Leyla’s House” (2006), is already in its 48th edition, and has been published by Gallimard in France. One of his most celebrated novels is “Bliss” (2002), which has been translated into 10 languages and was made into
an acclaimed film in 2007. The book deals with tensions between modern and traditional values in Turkish society as a 15-year-old girl, Meryem, journeys from her home town to the capital to escape the threat of an honor killing by her family. In the company of Cemal, her cousin, she encounters Irfan, a successful academic alienated from his urban
existence, and his own identity, and the trio embark on a voyage of self discovery.

On the occasion of the publication of the Chinese edition of “Bliss,” Livaneli visited Beijing in June 2010, where ARTINFO China spoke with him.

You are known as a musician, a writer, a filmmaker and politician. Which role do you prefer?
I prefer to write. I am a storyteller. To express yourself, music is the best tool; to tell a story or analyze a situation or create characters, you have to write. Film takes a long time and you have to relate to other people: if one fails, we all fail. Being a politician is boring. Does the character Meryem in “Bliss” represent Turkish women?
Actually, I started to write about the professor. A few chapters later, I added a young girl from the south of Turkey, who I saw as a victim … When she entered the story, she got bigger and bigger. She created herself and I followed her. Of course, she represents women in Turkey. Generally, I think women are stronger than men. Not only in Turkey, but anywhere. They give birth, work and raise children. Everybody thinks women are more emotional than men. No! Maybe they are emotional, but they’re rational as well.

What was your experience like when you were exiled for eight years?
I learned a lot. In Europe, I bonded with a lot of artists and musicians of different nationalities. I am cosmopolitan,
so I understand different cultures. It was a difficult time, because I had no money. Many immigrants have to wash dishes for a living: I made my living by music. Luckily for me, my music was popular.

How did it feel to go from being a political refugee to a member of parliament?
My passports tell my life story. My first passport was a fake which I bought to get away from my country. My
second one was a refugee passport issued by the UN. I then got a normal Turkish passport — that was my third. Later, when I was made a UNESCO Goodwill Ambassador and became a Member of Parliament, I was issued with a red diplomatic passport. Imagine — with different passports, I got different treatment everywhere, but it was always me. I was the same person! When I held the first passport, I was a criminal. When I showed the red passport, I was a very important person. It’s ridiculous. Society is so bureaucratic.